FrostCloud Forums  

Go Back   FrostCloud Forums > Politics > Politics and World Events

Greetings!

Politics and World Events A place for all you liberals, conservatives, and even radicals.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 12-08-2006, 07:26 PM
ArghMonkey's Avatar
ArghMonkey ArghMonkey is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 14,434
UN study says 2% of adults have 50% of world's wealth, Bottom 50% have a mere 1%

Quote:
The verdict is on "trickle down" economics, the marketplace theory hailed by conservatives from Ronald Reagan and Margaret Thatcher to Brian Mulroney and the two George Bushes.

The promise - in reality the big lie - was based on the idea that the greater the wealth at the top, the more would trickle down to the bottom.

It didn't work - never has, and never will. It was just another cover for greed.

After 25 years of freewheeling global capitalism, including endless tax cuts for the wealthy, an orgy of free trade and the emergence of a supposedly global economy, the rich are stunningly richer than ever while the poor have fallen farther behind than ever.

The numbers are breathtaking.

A report by the World Institute for Development Economics Research, a UN agency based in Finland, finds that more than 40% of all household wealth on the planet is now owned by 1% of world adults, most of them in Europe and the United States. The top 2% own more than 50%, and the top 10% have corralled 85% of the planet's wealth.

By contrast, the bottom 50% of all adults on the planet lay claim to just 1% of the wealth.

The statistics are based on data collected in 2000. If the same trend has continued since then, and there are few doubts it has, the situation is even worse today.
http://www.nupge.ca/news_2006/n07de06a.htm
__________________
**************
*************************

Dragon busted on his lies ... HERE!

**
*******
**************
*******
**

"I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man's reasoning powers are not above the monkey's - Mark Twain

*************************
**************
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
  #2  
Old 12-08-2006, 07:37 PM
Galphanore's Avatar
Galphanore Galphanore is offline
Devil's Advocate
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 2,554
Send a message via AIM to Galphanore Send a message via Yahoo to Galphanore
If you make more then 50,000 dollars a year you are in the top 10%. You are comparing middle-class Americans and sub-Saharan farmers. Countries with trickle-down economies make up that 10%.
__________________
To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that we are to stand by the president right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.
-- Theodore Roosevelt
To know what is right and not to do it is the worst cowardice.
--Confucius

Remember, Democracy can not be spread by the barrel of a gun.

I'm a Libertarian Transhumanist Atheist and a proud member of the reality-based community.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 12-08-2006, 07:50 PM
jackson33 jackson33 is offline
Veteran
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,343
the United Nations??? certainly you have a better source to explain the success of Global Economics. 2% of population is 130 million and i suppose this is about 80 million adults. thats a lot of rich people and i suggest far more then there were in 1980. the 10% is 650 million and about 400 million adults. thats incredible so many have benefited. did they mention GDP of the planet which is up nearly 1000% since 1980 and all people of all countries have some to extreme gains in personal wealth. going from 1k per year to 20k per year is no less remarkable then 1m to 20m and much harder to accomplish. think trickle down has been highly successful. by the way that mentioned 730 million have kids, spouses and relatives making their influance about 2 billion.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 12-08-2006, 08:29 PM
Galphanore's Avatar
Galphanore Galphanore is offline
Devil's Advocate
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 2,554
Send a message via AIM to Galphanore Send a message via Yahoo to Galphanore
Quote:
Originally Posted by jackson33
the United Nations??? certainly you have a better source to explain the success of Global Economics. 2% of population is 130 million and i suppose this is about 80 million adults. thats a lot of rich people and i suggest far more then there were in 1980. the 10% is 650 million and about 400 million adults. thats incredible so many have benefited. did they mention GDP of the planet which is up nearly 1000% since 1980 and all people of all countries have some to extreme gains in personal wealth. going from 1k per year to 20k per year is no less remarkable then 1m to 20m and much harder to accomplish. think trickle down has been highly successful. by the way that mentioned 730 million have kids, spouses and relatives making their influance about 2 billion.
Of course the article monkey linked didn't mention any of that, it would take away from his absurd claim that capitalism is a failure.
__________________
To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that we are to stand by the president right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.
-- Theodore Roosevelt
To know what is right and not to do it is the worst cowardice.
--Confucius

Remember, Democracy can not be spread by the barrel of a gun.

I'm a Libertarian Transhumanist Atheist and a proud member of the reality-based community.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 12-08-2006, 09:11 PM
ArghMonkey's Avatar
ArghMonkey ArghMonkey is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 14,434
Quote:
Originally Posted by jackson33
the United Nations??? certainly you have a better source to explain the success of Global Economics. 2% of population is 130 million and i suppose this is about 80 million adults. thats a lot of rich people and i suggest far more then there were in 1980. the 10% is 650 million and about 400 million adults. thats incredible so many have benefited. did they mention GDP of the planet which is up nearly 1000% since 1980 and all people of all countries have some to extreme gains in personal wealth. going from 1k per year to 20k per year is no less remarkable then 1m to 20m and much harder to accomplish. think trickle down has been highly successful. by the way that mentioned 730 million have kids, spouses and relatives making their influance about 2 billion.

*LOL* Your writing off the U.N. ?!

I love how ppl that have little to no claim to know better then a huge, mulinational expert group tend to speak so loudly ...

Im all for stats that say something but writing off the U.N. for no good reason, other then you hate the U.N. because it doesnt do what the u.s. tells it to, thats laughable ...
__________________
**************
*************************

Dragon busted on his lies ... HERE!

**
*******
**************
*******
**

"I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man's reasoning powers are not above the monkey's - Mark Twain

*************************
**************
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 12-08-2006, 09:12 PM
Galphanore's Avatar
Galphanore Galphanore is offline
Devil's Advocate
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 2,554
Send a message via AIM to Galphanore Send a message via Yahoo to Galphanore
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArghMonkey
*LOL* Your writing off the U.N. ?!

I love how ppl that have little to no claim to know better then a huge, mulinational expert group tend to speak so loudly ...

Im all for stats that say something but writing off the U.N. for no good reason, other then you hate the U.N. because it doesnt do what the u.s. tells it to, thats laughable ...
Completely agree, there's nothing wrong with the UN report, just your interpretation of it.
__________________
To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that we are to stand by the president right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.
-- Theodore Roosevelt
To know what is right and not to do it is the worst cowardice.
--Confucius

Remember, Democracy can not be spread by the barrel of a gun.

I'm a Libertarian Transhumanist Atheist and a proud member of the reality-based community.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 12-08-2006, 09:20 PM
ArghMonkey's Avatar
ArghMonkey ArghMonkey is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 14,434
Quote:
While it's hard to see it here in the U.S., "trickle-down" economics is beginning to be confronted by popular democratic movements, which are bubbling up in communities across the country as well as all over the world in countries like Ghana and Bolivia, where fierce resistance to the privatization of water not only pushed big water multinationals like Bechtel out of the country , but led the government of Bolivia to begin pushing the world's international financial institutions to exempt water from trade liberalization (i.e. corporate predation) agreements and bolster effots to reverse now widely-discredited structural adjustment programs that have forced debtor nations to privatize essential services like water in exchange for usurious loan packages.


Activists who went to the World Water Forum held in Mexico City last month say that Bolivia's experience is beginning to show signs of rippling out to the rest of the world, becoming a significant model that the struggle for democracy can use to challenge the cold logic of "trickle-down" economics -- i.e. the bogus arguments for efficiency etc. by which privatization is sold.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/charli...r_b_18865.html
__________________
**************
*************************

Dragon busted on his lies ... HERE!

**
*******
**************
*******
**

"I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man's reasoning powers are not above the monkey's - Mark Twain

*************************
**************
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 12-08-2006, 09:23 PM
ArghMonkey's Avatar
ArghMonkey ArghMonkey is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 14,434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Galphanore
Completely agree, there's nothing wrong with the UN report, just your interpretation of it.
I didnt interpret anything, i posted an artcile, but for that matter I agree with it ...

I would love to see something proving that its wrong ...
__________________
**************
*************************

Dragon busted on his lies ... HERE!

**
*******
**************
*******
**

"I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man's reasoning powers are not above the monkey's - Mark Twain

*************************
**************
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 12-08-2006, 09:24 PM
Galphanore's Avatar
Galphanore Galphanore is offline
Devil's Advocate
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 2,554
Send a message via AIM to Galphanore Send a message via Yahoo to Galphanore
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArghMonkey
I didnt interpret anything, i posted an artcile, but for that matter I agree with it ...

I would love to see something proving that its wrong ...
http://www.tysknews.com/Depts/gov_ph..._a_failure.htm
__________________
To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that we are to stand by the president right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.
-- Theodore Roosevelt
To know what is right and not to do it is the worst cowardice.
--Confucius

Remember, Democracy can not be spread by the barrel of a gun.

I'm a Libertarian Transhumanist Atheist and a proud member of the reality-based community.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 12-08-2006, 09:27 PM
Galphanore's Avatar
Galphanore Galphanore is offline
Devil's Advocate
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 2,554
Send a message via AIM to Galphanore Send a message via Yahoo to Galphanore
Quote:
Originally Posted by Monkey
While it's hard to see it here in the U.S., "trickle-down" economics is beginning to be confronted by popular democratic movements, which are bubbling up in communities across the country as well as all over the world in countries like Ghana and Bolivia, where fierce resistance to the privatization of water not only pushed big water multinationals like Bechtel out of the country , but led the government of Bolivia to begin pushing the world's international financial institutions to exempt water from trade liberalization (i.e. corporate predation) agreements and bolster effots to reverse now widely-discredited structural adjustment programs that have forced debtor nations to privatize essential services like water in exchange for usurious loan packages.

Activists who went to the World Water Forum held in Mexico City last month say that Bolivia's experience is beginning to show signs of rippling out to the rest of the world, becoming a significant model that the struggle for democracy can use to challenge the cold logic of "trickle-down" economics -- i.e. the bogus arguments for efficiency etc. by which privatization is sold.
I agree, we shouldn't allow corporations to abuse employees or communities. This, however, is not a required part of capitalism. It is a side effect of corruption and obsession, how about you explain how socialism would be any better for these people?
__________________
To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that we are to stand by the president right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.
-- Theodore Roosevelt
To know what is right and not to do it is the worst cowardice.
--Confucius

Remember, Democracy can not be spread by the barrel of a gun.

I'm a Libertarian Transhumanist Atheist and a proud member of the reality-based community.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 12-08-2006, 11:06 PM
ArghMonkey's Avatar
ArghMonkey ArghMonkey is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 14,434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Galphanore
I agree, we shouldn't allow corporations to abuse employees or communities. This, however, is not a required part of capitalism. It is a side effect of corruption and obsession, how about you explain how socialism would be any better for these people?
Well thats not the point I was making.

The unbalance of money is a negative, it creates a larger and larger class of ppl living in poverty and it destroys the middle class, this is already happening in north america and around the world.

American style capitalism is driven by extreme greed.

My point is there is a huge problem that needs addressing, an obvious imbalance exists, lets not pretend it doesnt.

We could change the subject and speculate how socialismn could do it better and it would be easy to see how that would be true, simply because the people, the mass population, on whole, would control their own resources, the profit made would be shared equally, btw, just for clarification socialism exists within capitalism and vice versa, dont pull a dragon on me here galph, you should know a bit better then that ...
__________________
**************
*************************

Dragon busted on his lies ... HERE!

**
*******
**************
*******
**

"I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man's reasoning powers are not above the monkey's - Mark Twain

*************************
**************
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 12-08-2006, 11:11 PM
Galphanore's Avatar
Galphanore Galphanore is offline
Devil's Advocate
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 2,554
Send a message via AIM to Galphanore Send a message via Yahoo to Galphanore
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArghMonkey
Well thats not the point I was making.

The unbalance of money is a negative, it creates a larger and larger class of ppl living in poverty and it destroys the middle class, this is already happening in north america and around the world.

American style capitalism is driven by extreme greed.

My point is there is a huge problem that needs addressing, an obvious imbalance exists, lets not pretend it doesnt.

We could change the subject and speculate how socialismn could do it better and it would be easy to see how that would be true, simply because the people, the mass population, on whole, would control their own resources, the profit made would be shared equally, btw, just for clarification socialism exists within capitalism and vice versa, dont pull a dragon on me here galph, you should know a bit better then that ...
Socialist countries are not controled by the people, they are controled by the government that claims it does what the people want, but more often then not does not do so. I am well aware that socialism exists in capitalism and vice versa, I just dislike a great many of the socalist ideas that people are trying to push through, because they don't work. Like universal health care, that is failing in Canada. The ideals of socialism sound wonderful, but they are just that, ideals. When met with reality we find out how flimsy they actually are.
__________________
To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that we are to stand by the president right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.
-- Theodore Roosevelt
To know what is right and not to do it is the worst cowardice.
--Confucius

Remember, Democracy can not be spread by the barrel of a gun.

I'm a Libertarian Transhumanist Atheist and a proud member of the reality-based community.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 12-08-2006, 11:17 PM
free tibet's Avatar
free tibet free tibet is offline
Child of the Korn.
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Manchester, UK
Posts: 6,389
Send a message via MSN to free tibet
We all know that trickle down economics is a farce that has failed miserably, we didn't need the UN to tell us that. Trickle down economics failed because the exorbitant tax cuts for the wealthy, that were meant to stimulate the economy, actually resulted in huge government deficits. When the economic boon Reagan predicted did not materialize, interest rates soared as the deficit grew to unmanageable levels. It took more than a decade to set the economy on the right course, which occurred when President Clinton's first budget passed Congress in 1993, without one Republican vote. The economy remained strong as a result of fiscally responsible spending and concentrated efforts to pay down the debt.

Yet despite the proven track record of these financial policies, President Bush used his first State of the Union address to introduce a $1.6 trillion tax cut package that would give 43% of the benefit to the wealthiest 1% of Americans. Those who make over $900,000 a year would be the prime beneficiaries. Even Bill Gates, Warren Buffet, and members of the Rockefeller family believe giving them this unnecessary tax cut will result in cuts to Social Security, Medicare and other essential programs, or even worse, cause taxes to increase on those who can least afford it.

It is failed, trickle down economic policy that needs to remain in the history books as a lesson learned, not a mistake repeated.
__________________
'Rise like Lions after slumber
In unvanquishable number,
Shake your chains to earth like dew
Which in sleep had fallen on you -
Ye are many - they are few.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 12-08-2006, 11:25 PM
ArghMonkey's Avatar
ArghMonkey ArghMonkey is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 14,434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Galphanore
Socialist countries are not controled by the people, they are controled by the government that claims it does what the people want, but more often then not does not do so. I am well aware that socialism exists in capitalism and vice versa, I just dislike a great many of the socalist ideas that people are trying to push through, because they don't work. Like universal health care, that is failing in Canada. The ideals of socialism sound wonderful, but they are just that, ideals. When met with reality we find out how flimsy they actually are.
I dont doubt that you believe that and there are examples of communism that didnt work, thats for sure but most of europe has many socialist ideas, free education, free healthcare, etc and it works great.

You can find conservatives here in Canada that think health care isent working but its a scam, it actually still works great, really the only issue the ney sayers cling to is the waiting lines but these reports are exagerated, no emergency cases are left to wait and a 5 month waiting time for a hip replacement isent outrageous.

Whats going on is businesses want access to the hundreds of millions of dollars that go into our health care and when we brought the conservatives in they cut so much of the money that these issues appeared, even then they arent huge and they arent worth throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

Ask yourself how expensive it is to run a police force or in the case of the u.s. how much money is spent on the military, there is plenty of money to supply top notch quality care to everyone for the cost you already pay in taxes, look at some european models to backup the idea, trust me, as far as developed worlds go americans health care is the worst.

Socialist ideas do work *L* and have worked and are working and will work *L*

Everything from quality health care to education to parks to u name it are "socialist" ideas, the problem is you live in the u.s. and its taught to you as evil, you need to look at examples where its already implemented, look at that finland link I posted, they have a BETTER life then americans and its all due to a sharing of wealth through social principles.

If you cant even find out whats going on then your going to be in the same group as dragon, spewing rhetoric instead of talking about whats already working and what needs to be improved.
__________________
**************
*************************

Dragon busted on his lies ... HERE!

**
*******
**************
*******
**

"I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man's reasoning powers are not above the monkey's - Mark Twain

*************************
**************
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 12-09-2006, 05:05 AM
Dragon's Avatar
Dragon Dragon is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Chicago
Posts: 29,365
Send a message via AIM to Dragon Send a message via MSN to Dragon Send a message via Yahoo to Dragon
Problem is you used the nice word free, well guess what....ITS NOT FREE!!!!

I dont think some of you get it, nothing is EVER free. The sheer fact that when our leaders of the past and present given us tax cuts....EVERYONE in this nation recieved it, not just the poor, but EVERYONE. We all benifited.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Is "MAN" = "A GOD" TruthInArt General Philosophy 54 02-04-2005 04:22 AM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 07:35 PM.



Powered by: vBulletin
Copyright 2000-2008 Jelsoft Enterprises Limited
Hosted and Maintained by The IceStorm Network