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  #31  
Old 04-22-2008, 03:42 AM
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- Imagine there are no humans today , ... like life wasn't " borned " at all , ... even today , ... simply , there still isn't life on Earth , ... just imagine this , ... > > > as all of us don't exist " yet " , there's noone to say , ... LOOK ! ... THERE'S " " " * * * [ [ [ SOMETHING ] ] ] * * * " " " , ... ... it's *** DARK *** , it's *** QUITE *** , its *** NON-EXISTING *** ... - > ' now ' , ....
vivid Film...
all of you said I understand;carefully to see,i found what your want said is like generate history of the universe and human.everything you said is facts which already know.IMHO,"before born" is a critical..the human thoghts is not only express form at universe;i believe there is another form can "thinking",we must breakthrough our special thinking mode,the universe way of it..not display by us only..because we are confined by own "mind",this "mind" constraint us...you can think that..why we are think in background provide by universe,if there is no space,no times,no everything...but EXIST existence..JUST LIKE:
if we don't have eyes,however,we don't claim nothing have
if we don't have taste,however,we don't claim nothing made
if we don't have aware(baby mind),we don't claim nothing do

all your thinking is part of your own background;the earth,the planet give us infomation built own datebase..but everyone couldn't explain the marginal of the cosmos,why?we are born to nothing,just for ourselves behavior.
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  #32  
Old 04-22-2008, 10:58 PM
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...the human thoghts is not only express form at universe;i believe there is another form can "thinking",we must breakthrough our special thinking mode,the universe way of it..not display by us only..because we are confined by own "mind",this "mind" constraint us...

all your thinking is part of your own background;the earth,the planet give us infomation built own datebase..but everyone couldn't explain the marginal of the cosmos,why?we are born to nothing,just for ourselves behavior.
- I hear you , ... yes , ... our mind is ' limited ' , or to say , * free * _ up to certain level - intelligence means freedom in a way ... the same case with animals , with all families ... a little mouse for example , ... also has a mind ( ofcourse ) and his mind is also limited , ... he can't create a thought of himself in the level we can , ... his brain structure is not ' leting ' that ... he does not realize " environment " as we do , ... so , we can step forward and consider ourselves as that mouse , ... maybe there are life forms out there , realizing " environment " better than us , ... they ' see ' more , ... they ' hear ' more ... they posess bigger * freedom * ...

... there simply couldn't appear a special or ? * thought * inside your mind ... , a * thought * that isn't a consequence ( in whatever level ) of " environment " , ... ... , but you think otherwise , ... you're talking about " special thinking mode " , ... I don't know what to say ... tell me , what ( something ) makes you believe there's something like this ... ?! ...
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  #33  
Old 04-23-2008, 06:56 AM
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... maybe there are life forms out there , realizing " environment " better than us , ... they ' see ' more , ... they ' hear ' more ... they posess bigger * freedom * ...
I agree with that,i think is apposite metaphor of "limited".

Quote:
... there simply couldn't appear a special or ? * thought * inside your mind ... , a * thought * that isn't a consequence ( in whatever level ) of " environment " , ... ...
IMO,i think "thought" is "None",we thinking lots,we deny lots.. yes,i think so a*thought*isn't a consequence..but does we sure we can reach the so called
"ultimate thoughts"?like Physics want everything under a theory control?

Quote:
... you're talking about " special thinking mode " , ...
i can't certain it.. i mean,does we really we know everthing in front of us,we can test Roket on Earth,we can launch the robot on Mars,we "can" warp lights;every attempt like we are make everything under control,but sometime we always tangle by "mind self"..might be infomation leaked(might use "lacked")..where is it?..i don't know,our suspect ourself,we are not perfect as you said ..the problem is how we realize our thinking ways are unique..it's our weakness,the misunderstanding of outside "world".
I hope my words clear to express what i want to say.
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  #34  
Old 04-25-2008, 02:55 PM
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i think "thought" is "None",we thinking lots,we deny lots.. yes,i think so a*thought*isn't a consequence...
- No zuo , ... no , ... you're wrong , ... think again , ... ... , becouse thought really is a consequence ... , nothing happens for no reason zuo , and you know that ... a window can't brake itself , ... a door can't open itself ... , leafs on the ground can't move themself ... sea can't create big waves itself ... all of it = just like that , ... for no reason at all , ... from nothing , ... simply NO , ...

... whatever you're thinking you're thinking on the basis of " consequences - effects - consequences " ... ... mind seems complicated , but that doesn't mean he's in chaos , that he's out of order ... ... , real chaos zuo , ... " detaily " speaking , ... doesn't exist , here or there ... * rules * are what you have everywhere ...

Quote:
i mean,does we really we know everthing in front of us...
- No , we don't and we'll never know ... ... , we know something , and we're exaggerating that something quite much ... ... , if * existence * is infinite , and probably is , ... then , whatever we know - always is " nothing " , to say so ...
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  #35  
Old 04-25-2008, 03:02 PM
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The window needs something to cause it to break, not a reason to break. A reason would suggest a destiny. Nothing happens for any other reason than consequence of another action. To suggest that the window would have the rock thrown through it and this would allow the insect to lay it's eggs inside which would poison the cat who would've eaten the mouse that had the miracle to everlasting life in it's genetic code so humans could live for ever would be a coincidence.
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  #36  
Old 04-26-2008, 03:32 AM
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... mind seems complicated , but that doesn't mean he's in chaos , that he's out of order ...
does it real?every morning when i wake up,whatever we thoughts or not,i fall into chaos..what is order?the order made by ours..the day time passed..every
thing look so good..but we just search&struggle in it..the nature's law,i mean the real meaning of the "existence" exert "force" on our "material body"..but we are even did not know what "real" of us,"The Chaos in Chaos"..the mind play apart in the routine day..we are lost in false,lost in Chao.

Quote:
... , if * existence * is infinite , and probably is , ... then , whatever we know - always is " nothing " , to say so ...
i am afraid of this;does we right or wrong enough?i don't even think this horror
things...
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  #37  
Old 04-26-2008, 03:37 AM
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As you said
Quote:
The window needs something to cause it to break, not a reason to break.
Nenad
Quote:
" consequences - effects - consequences " ...
IMHO;we couldn't grasp everything in <LAWs made by ourselves>..Right or Wrong?
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  #38  
Old 04-26-2008, 10:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ca$hback
Nothing happens for any other reason than consequence of another action.
- Exactly the point , and that's obvious ... , everything effects everything , since everything is " connected " ( in one ) ... so , ' behind ' every event there's an event that is a cause of it ... rules are present ( laws of physics ) ( events = rules ) , and so everything * happens * the way it can , the way it must ... perfectly , ... no mistake ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by zuozuo
...what is order?...
- Good question , ... if we speak of * existence * , the answer is ofcourse - [ ONE way ] ( or just * existence * ) , ... becouse , ' IT ' is all about order ...

... mistakes , errors , < chaos > ... ... - these do not exist within * existence * ... ... ... , * existence * [ ONE way ] actually means - " **** unbreakable perfection **** , ...

... chaos in everyday life is something else ...


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ca$hback
To suggest that the window would have the rock thrown through it and this would allow the insect to lay it's eggs inside which would poison the cat who would've eaten the mouse that had the miracle to everlasting life in it's genetic code so humans could live for ever would be a coincidence.
- This is something like a [ ONE way ] " medium " explanation ... ... , and the word * [ [ [ ALLOW ] ] ] * is the key word in the text , ...
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  #39  
Old 04-27-2008, 05:08 AM
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so everything * happens * the way it can , the way it must ... perfectly , ... no mistake ...
how "no mistake" work?..can't imagine that,the realitys have mistake..why do you said this could occurd(no mistake)?if there is no mistake..nothing happen..or how to definition "Mistake"..and the Nature's mistake?

Quote:
... mistakes , errors , < chaos > ... ... - these do not exist within * existence * ... ... ... , * existence * [ ONE way ] actually means - " **** unbreakable perfection **** , ...
like above;i don't think that the "existence" could exist without "something else" might be call—Mistakes..the mistake should not like as the mistake made by ours(for example:Cheating)..the mistaken of "real one" is opposite one——i do not just divide thing two side(positive&negative)..just a way.
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  #40  
Old 04-28-2008, 04:04 PM
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how "no mistake" work?..can't imagine that,the realitys have mistake..why do you said this could occurd(no mistake)?
... "no mistake" works perfectly zuo , how else ? ... and , you're wrong , ... , reality never " heard " of error ... , reality is [ ONE way ] , and IT describes exactly that - * perfection * ... , * everything * ( * existence * ) " works " by the rule/s , perfectly , ...

Quote:
if there is no mistake..nothing happen..or how to definition "Mistake"..and the Nature's mistake?
- The first part of the sentence is total nonsense zuo , ... it has nothing to do with anything , ... that was really unnecessary , ...

... nature's ( * existence * ) mistakes do not exist , as I already said ... ... , mistakes as mistakes are related to " life - mind " ( living beings ) , ... for example , bad judgement ... or similar ... ... , do you understand now ? ... it's quite simple , ...


Quote:
like above;i don't think that the "existence" could exist without "something else" might be call—Mistakes..the mistake should not like as the mistake made by ours(for example:Cheating)..the mistaken of "real one" is opposite one——i do not just divide thing two side(positive&negative)..just a way.
- I said above ... , your problem is becouse you think of * life * ( limited - unperfect ) , and then , you ' paste ' your conclusions to the reality around ... it makes no sense at all , ... things don't work that way ...

... look around and tell me , where do you see mistakes , .... find me a SINGLE one ... , but before you do that , please , ... think good and think hard ... ... - see it yourself there're no mistakes around you , ... " laws of physics " are not mistakes zuo , ... they are exactly what they are - *** LAWS *** ... so , no chaos present " outside " ...
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  #41  
Old 04-28-2008, 04:20 PM
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- And , one more thing ... I always forget to say this , ... ... > [ ONE way ] is what theists call God , ... ... becouse , [ ONE way ] is responsible for * existence * , for itself more precisely ... ...
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  #42  
Old 04-29-2008, 10:48 AM
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Okay,let's discuss deeply..
At first,I a declare that understanding the whole contents what you said

I am no doubt about there has a law called "Nature"..we are involve in Nature,could not detach from it whatever Force or Thoughts.this law never ending,it is passing and adding everyday..**PAUSE**..(when every pause occured,a theory or our thoughts flicker)..does nature can think everything wrong or right?of course not,the nature begin no reason..it is just provided one thing to us——Knowing what we are!

We are analyze her "body"—Physical World,learning her "mental"—Our Thought,each of them has automatic activities*Supernova Explode、Dust Gather、Matters Motion*..
Quote:
... , * everything * ( * existence * ) " works " by the rule/s , perfectly , ...
because we are in "laws"..we don't need luxury hope to escape "a workable rule".
Quote:
... nature's ( * existence * ) mistakes do not exist , as I already said ...
the existence exist eternal..you must know the "dead" in nature also a existence.but Nature has another to do herself..if one not so called "law"..amistake will be made..we don't realize it..because it safe now
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  #43  
Old 04-29-2008, 10:55 AM
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... > [ ONE way ] is what theists call God , ...
I rather believe [ONE way] than God;
I'm neither atheism nor theists,just NATURE.
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  #44  
Old 04-29-2008, 03:31 PM
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We live in a material world. Our immaterial thoughts represent the input we've acquired from it. The fundamental forces that interact to hold the building blocks together are to be understood by ever looking closer at the fractal-like nature of discovery. Materialism and technology are the seccular companions of many people's notions of progress. Morality and fairness are the sobering reminders of why we discover, engineer and implement: To improve our quality of life.
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  #45  
Old 04-29-2008, 09:36 PM
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the existence exist eternal
... why ? ... > [ ONE way ] = it must be that way , ... * existence * must be / forever \ - present from the time imemmorial ( it never " heard " of time ) ... it must be endless ( infinite ) , ... all the components must be infinite ( matter ) ... ... it simply must be as it ( already ) is ...

Quote:
you must know the "dead" in nature also a existence
... zuo , when I say * existence * , I mean on everything existing and non - existing > all and everything which is in a way ...

Quote:
I'm neither atheism nor theists,just NATURE.
- If you find yourself " natural " as you say , you're an atheist then , ... mean , aren't you ? ... maybe I'm wrong but , isn't " natural " like - [ natural - correct - true / truly ] ...
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