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  #1  
Old 03-14-2007, 03:03 AM
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Is Kyoto Protocol Right?

Now i will be showing some of the scientists both not only in Canada but else where that says this forcing of ethics on others is not scientific.
One such group is Friends of Science.
http://friendsofscience.org/

Sallie Baliunas
Professor Tim Patterson
Douglas Leahey
Dr. Madhav Khandekar
Professor Chris de Freitas


What i find interesting is that they dont discard the whole idea of warming, just the fact of how it is labeled a human reason.
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Old 03-14-2007, 05:47 AM
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Oh shit *LOL*

Only you would be suckered into this ...


Tim Ball is a lieing sack that was exposed in the Globe and Mail for being funded by the oil industry, he sued the Globe and Mail, not because they were wrong but because he said it made it hard for him to make money *LOL*

Heres the real info you ignorant twit ...



Quote:
Origins

The Friends of Science was founded in 2002, with an active website since October, 2002 (as viewed at archive.org) [4]. The initial list of "professional contacts" included [5]: In 2006, Charles Montgomery reported in the Globe and Mail that Tom Harris (at the time employed at the Ottawa office of APCO Worldwide) "organized the Friends' first Ottawa press conference in 2002" [6], citing Friends of Science spokesperson Albert Jacobs. Montgomery further commented, in private e-mail correspondence dated February 8, 2007: "Jacobs told me that Harris has been a good friend to FOS, but he added that Harris didn't want people to know this."
In responding to a Wunderblog post about him [7], Harris stated: "You imply I had something to do with organizing 'the fraud operation known as "Friends of Science" '. Correction: No, FOS started up on their own." [8]
[edit]
Canadian Meteorological and Oceanographic Society Congress No-Show

At the 40th Annual Canadian Meteorological and Oceanographic Society (CMOS) congress held in early June 2006 in Toronto, Canada, "Canada's leading scientific society on climate called for urgent government action on climate change," Stephen Leahy wrote for Inter Press Service.
Ian Rutherford, CMOS executive director, told Leahy that "the CMOS membership representing more than 800 public and private scientists" made a public statement that the "scientific evidence dictates that in order to stabilise the climate, global reductions in greenhouse gas emissions need to go far beyond those mandated under this Kyoto Protocol."
Though not CMOS's first public statement, it was one of the most "vocal about climate change of late" due to the fact "that Canada's new Conservative government does not support the Kyoto Protocol for lower emissions of greenhouse gases, and opposed stricter emissions for a post-Kyoto agreement at a United Nations meeting in Bonn in May [2006]" and because "a small, previously invisible group of global warming sceptics called the Friends of Science are suddenly receiving attention from the Canadian government and media," Leahy wrote.
"The Conservative government is listening to them (the sceptics) because they tell them what they want to hear," Rutherford told IPS. However, Rutherford said, "No member from Friends of Science presented any papers, viewpoints or even attended the CMOS meeting," Leahy wrote. "They never present their arguments in front of scientists and should not be listened to," Rutherford said. [9]
[edit]
Lobbyists and Political Connections

According to the Lobbyists Registration System, Government of Canada, Bryan Thomas and Morten Paulsen of Fleishman-Hillard Canada Inc. are registered lobbyists for the Friends of Science Society. Registration records show that services were due to expire in August 2006. [10]
Morten Paulsen, who "has close Conservative ties", is not only registered as a lobbyist for Friends of Science, but also for "several petroleum companies including Conoco-Phillips Canada, and Kinder Morgan Canada Inc. Paulsen has long been active in the federal Conservative Party and its Reform/Alliance predecessors, serving as Preston Manning's communication director, managing MP Art Hanger's 2004 election campaign, and also holding high-ranking positions with the Alberta Conservatives," according to the Liberal Party of Canada in Alberta in August 2006. [11]
Canadian Conservative MP Bob Mills, environment critic under then Opposition Leader Stephen Harper for both the Canadian Alliance and the Conservative Party, was a longtime supporter of the Friends of Science and their scientific advisors. In a press release dated July 18, 2002, Bob Mills defended climate change skeptics like the Friends of Science and Richard Lindzen: "The fact that Dr. Lindzen and thousands of other scientists disagree with the Canadian government’s one-sided view of climate change in no way invalidates their valuable contributions to understanding this complex science."
Specifically, Mills complained, "[The] Climate Change Secretariat would not allow Kyoto science skeptics such as [FoS scientific advisor] Professor Tim Patterson, a leading paleo-climatoligist, into the Kyoto public consultations sessions held in June." The press release gave as a contact Tom Harris, Mills's legislative assistant who went on to become an associate at APCO Worldwide later that year (see also FoS Origins above).
Later, Bob Mills enabled the appearance of the Friends of Science, in the persons of then President Charles Simpson and Tim Patterson, before the House of Commons Standing Committee on Environment and Sustainable Development on February 10, 2005.[12] During the testimony, Mills asked cogent questions such as: "[i]s CO2 really a poisonous, hazardous waste?"
After the Conservative election victory in 2006, Mills's relationship with climate change skeptics cooled. In Financial Post article dated December 5, 2006, Tom Harris and Tim Ball complained: "Somewhere along the road to power, Mills' questioning of the science of Kyoto and his demands for open consultations on the issue subsided. He removed all traces of his previous position from his Web site (bobmillsmp.com)."
[edit]
Funding

As reported by Charles Montgomery in the Globe and Mail, Prof. Barry Cooper of the University of Calgary "set up a fund at the university dubbed the Science Education Fund. Donors were encouraged to give to the fund through the Calgary Foundation, which administers charitable giving in the Calgary area, and has a policy of guarding donors' identities. The Science Education Fund in turn provides money for the Friends of Science, as well as Tim Ball's travel expenses, according to Albert Jacobs, [spokesperson for the Friends of Science]."
The article continues: "Prof. Cooper and Mr. Jacobs both affirm that the Science Education Fund paid the bills for the Friends' anti-Kyoto video, Climate Catastrophe Cancelled." As to the source of the donations, "[The money's] not exclusively from the oil and gas industry," Cooper told Montgomery. [13]
As of March, 2006 the balance in the Science Education Fund stood at $76,000, according to the Calgary Foundation's 2006 annual report. The same report shows that $200,000 was disbursed from the Science Education Fund to the University of Calgary in the 2005-6 fiscal year. [14]
An older version of the FoS website news section featured an exchange between FoS and "an interested reader". This exchange has been removed from the current news section, and replaced with a link to a Word document version of the exchange [15]. However, the following question and answer have been removed from the Word document:
"Reader: Incidentally, I would truly appreciate if you could tell me how you are funded. Where does your money come from?
"FoS: We are funded through membership fees ($25/yr) and individual donations. Large projects - such as our video and radio ads - are funded through grants out of ... [the Science Education Fund], directed towards debate of climate science and which is also fed by the charitable Calgary Foundation." [16]
As detailed in the January 2007 newsletter [17], the Friends of Science continues to solicit both non-tax-deductible direct donations, as well as tax-deductible indirect donations to the Science Education Fund through the Calgary Foundation.
Calgary Foundation marketing director Kerry Longpré told Charles Montgomery that she had never heard of the Friends of Science. "The foundation, she said, deals only with the university, which is left to administer donations as it sees fit." [18]. According to the Calgary Foundation's 2006 report, the Science Education Fund is a "flow-through", donor-directed fund.[19] Dan Thorburn of the Calgary Foundation has confirmed that all funds disbursed in 2005-6 were paid to the University of Calgary Development Office at the request of the Fund's anonymous designated donor advisor. According to Thorburn, funded projects require letters of attestation confirming project spending in conformance with the original proposal, but the Foundation has not indicated whether or not such letters have been received with regard to the Science Education Fund projects.
Thus far, External Vice-President Roman Cooney of the University of Calgary has refused to furnish any information or documentation about the Science Education Fund, its ultimate recipients or funded projects. In an email dated February 15, 2007, Cooney made the following public statements regarding the Friends of Science and the Science Education Fund:
"The University of Calgary does not provide funding for Friends of Science. There is no University of Calgary trust fund for Friends of Science. We do not endorse its work or its findings ... The University of Calgary does not have a position on climate change, nor would it. As an independent, non-partisan research institution, the U of C insists on maintaining its neutrality.
"The fundamental principle is academic freedom ... In this case, a group of scientists holds a particular viewpoint and have advanced it publicly, with funding support from the external community. The fact that one of the scientists [i.e. political science professor Barry Cooper] is a faculty member here cannot be taken to conclude that the U of C supports that individual's research. The University of Calgary does not dictate to its professors the kind of research they will or will not do." [20]
In a telephone conversation on February 22, 2007, Mike Visser, the director of the Friends of Science anti-Kyoto video, confirmed that he was paid directly by the University of Calgary, presumably from monies donated to the Science Education Fund set up by Barry Cooper. It is not known whether monies from the Science Education Fund were used to pay expenses of other Friends of Science projects. But, as noted above, the Friends of Science Society has stated that the Fund also paid for anti-Kyoto radio ads and Tim Ball's travel expenses. However, there is no evidence that monies were disbursed to the Friends of Science itself from the university or from any research fund of a university faculty member.
[edit]
FoS's Reassuring Video

In April 2005, FoS released a video directed by Mike Visser entitled "Climate Catastrophe Cancelled" [21] in conjunction with Professor Barry Cooper of the Politics Department of the University of Calgary. The PR contact is listed as Sheila Roy of APCO Worldwide Canada, who have been involved in climate change denial since at latest 2002. [22] [23]
In a November 2005 email correspondence, Albert Jacobs indicated that Roy was hired on a one off basis though APCO is occasionally hired to "do specific jobs for us under incidental contracts, as the need arises."
The video features among others: The men featured in the video and the members of the FoS Scientific Advisory Board are all signatories to a letter that was sent to Canada's former Prime Minister Paul Martin and in 2006 to current Canadian Prime Minister, Stephen Harper, calling on them to "examine the scientific foundation of the federal government's climate-change plans" and "conduct a review of the Kyoto Protocol". The letter was dutifully reprinted in full by the right-wing National Post newspaper in Canada. [24]
The letter was signed by 60 scientists in total, however only 19 were actually Canadian and only half of the Canadian signatories could by any stretch of the imagination, be considered climate scientists. [25]
Paul Martin justifiably ignored this letter and signed on to Kyoto, while Prime Minister Harper’s Conservative government in May 2006 announced that Canada would develop a "made in Canada" approach to tackling greenhouse gas emissions, saying that the emission levels of Kyoto were not realistic. [26]
A recent magazine article in This Magazine had an extensive piece on how National Public Relations, along with the oil and gas industry, manufactured and coined the phrase "Made in Canada" in relation to climate change. [27]
[edit]
Radio Ad Campaign During 2006 Canadian Election Campaign

In late 2005, the Friends of Science mounted an anti-Kyoto radio ad campaign, tied to the Canadian federal election campaign, and funded through tax-deductible donations to the Science Education Fund via the Calgary Foundation (see section on Funding above). The January, 2006 newsletter describes the campaign:
"RADIO BLITZ
"Our campaign is working. Before and during the election, Friends bought radio advertising in 5 major Ontario markets. Our message was that voters have not been given the facts on climate change, and that candidates need to be questioned on their intentions to spend billions on global warming theories ...
"The response was intense ... We registered over 300,000 hits to our website in the first 12 days of January alone." [28]
The first ad outlines three supposed myths about global warming and urges listeners to "get the real answers at friendsofscience.org and then ask your MPs why they want to spend billions on global warming theories." The second ad refers to Canadian government policies such as the "One Ton Challenge". The ad concludes: "Have you been told the truth? ... Find out - watch our video at friendsofscience.org."
The election was held on January 23, 2006, following an eight-week campaign [29].
The FoS website as of December 21, 2005 features the headline "Who needs scientists, when you've got celebrities!!!", an attack on Environment Minister Stéphane Dion's solicitation of videotaped messages from international celebrities in connection with the 11th Session of the United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change (UNFCCC), hosted by Canada and held in Montreal in December, 2005.
The FoS home page also featured the message: "If you've heard our radio ads, thanks for visiting! Now watch the video by clicking the video link to your left." The anti-Kyoto video (see above) opens with clips featuring several members of the Government, including former Prime Minister Jean Chretien and Environment Minister Stéphane Dion, as well as Opposition members.
The Daily Oil Bulletin reported:
"In the run-up to the last federal election, a Calgary-based group called the Friends of Science Society aired 30-second radio spots which attacked the Kyoto Accord. The paid advertisements warned that the global warming agreement is scientifically unsound and economically destructive to Canada. The message reached 200,000 people in Ontario ridings where polls showed the Liberals had only a slight lead."
" 'There's no way to reliably assess how much influence our ads had,' acknowledges Eric Loughead, the society's vice-president. After they were aired, however, the non-profit group's website received a surge of 300,000 visitors, and the Conservatives did win several of the targeted ridings." [30]
Elections Canada rules on third party advertising cover any message "that takes a position on an issue with which a registered party or candidate is associated" and requires such advertisers to register with the Chief Electoral Officer. The rules also impose strict spending limits of $3000 per riding, ban the issuance of tax receipts for supporting contributions, and require the filing of detailed, audited financial reports. The Friends of Science Society does not appear on the list of registered third-party advertisers for the 2006 election and to all appearances has not met any of the obligations of third party advertisers.
[edit]
2007 Climate Change Conference

The Friends of Science are involved with a climate change conference, as detailed in the January, 2007 newsletter: "Barry Cooper of the University of Calgary and Tim Patterson of Carleton University are arranging a conference in Ottawa on the science of global climate change. The date will be April 19 & 20th. Friends of Science is providing backup support for the event... It is anticipated the conference will result in a well-publicised discussion demonstrating that the science of global warming is far from settled, in spite of what the Kyoto supporters would have us believe." [31]
The conference was first proposed by Friends of Science in their September, 2006 newsletter: "[W]e are focusing on a major conference to kick start the debate on climate science in Canada ..." [32]
The Toronto Star reported that Barry Cooper would provide much of the funding for the event (presumably through the Science Education Fund, although the Fund is not mentioned): "Meanwhile, Cooper, a political science professor and erstwhile mentor to Harper, has enough resources to offer travel and hotel costs, and $1,000 each, to the 13 people he invited to speak at the April conference in Ottawa, which he is mounting with the help of Friends of Science." [33]. The only one of the 13 identified by the Star is longtime Friends of Science scientific advisor Tim Ball.
[edit]
FoS misrepresents its affiliation with University of Calgary

Although key Friends of Science projects have received major funding from charitable donations funneled through the Calgary Foundation and the University of Calgary Development Office, Roman Cooney, the University of Calgary's vice-president of external relations, has insisted from the start that the Friends of Science is neither affiliated with nor endorsed by the university. "And when he saw the University of Calgary's coat of arms on early copies of the anti-Kyoto video, Mr. Cooney ordered Prof. Cooper to remove it." [34] The original version of the video, available on YouTube, also contains the opening and closing credit: "A UNIVERSITY OF CALGARY VIDEO In cooperation with the Friends of Science Society." The press release for the video also implied U of C affiliation: "Today, researchers at the University of Calgary, in cooperation with the Friends of Science Society, released a video entitled: Climate Catastrophe Cancelled".
Since that time, the university has objected to at least two more major misrepresentations on the part of the Friends of Science. In 2006, the FoS website newsection made the following statement (later removed): "Large projects - such as our video and radio ads - are funded through grants out of a University of Calgary Trust Fund, directed towards debate of climate science and which is also fed by the charitable Calgary Foundation." [35] The January, 2007 newsletter originally stated: "The University of Calgary, in conjunction with Carleton University in Ottawa, is planning on holding a conference in Ottawa on the science of global climate change." [36] Under pressure from the University of Calgary, the statement was revised to read: "Barry Cooper of the University of Calgary and Tim Patterson of Carleton University are arranging a conference in Ottawa on the science of global climate change." [37]
In February, 2007, Roman Cooney issued the following statement in an e-mail: "The University of Calgary has long-standing and publicly-stated concerns about Friends of Science using the University of Calgary's name to infer that it has the University's endorsement. Our response has included cease-and-desist directives to the Friends of Science from the University's legal counsel. Most recently, following a reference to the University of Calgary in a newsletter from the head of Friends of Science ... and under caution of legal action, I insisted that the Friends of Science provide the attached letter to clarify its relationship to the University of Calgary." [38]
The letter is dated January 23, 2007 and was sent to Roman Cooney and is signed by FoS president Douglas Leahey. The letter states in its entirety: "I wish to confirm that Friends of Science is not and has never been affiliated with the University of Calgary, nor does it receive, or has ever received, funding or support from the University of Calgary." [39]
[edit]
"Friends of Science" (FoS) is not "Friends Of Science" (FOS)

The FOS website friendsofscience.ca does not belong to FoS.
[edit]
Personnel
  • Douglas Leahey, president. "Dr. Leahey is an atmospheric physicist with extensive experience in the assessment of effects of sour gas, suphur dioxide, and other atmospheric contaminants." Dr. Leahey has worked with the Bercha Group on a number of joint projects including the Shell-Caroline Emergency Response Plan, and air quality assessments. He has recently collaborated with the Bercha Group on a number of sour gas drilling permit applications involving the effects of flaring on air quality. Dr. Leahey is an "independent consultant to the oil and gas industry." [40]
[edit]
Scientific Advisory Board
  • Tim Patterson, Professor of Geology and Paleoclimatology, Carleton University
[edit]
Former Scientific Advisors and Consultants
  • Tim Ball, Retired Professor of Climatology; Consultant
  • Tad Murty, Adjunct Professor in the Departments of Earth Sciences in The University of Ottawa
  • Ross McKitrick, Associate Professor of Economics at the University of Guelph; Senior Fellow at the Fraser Institute
[edit]
Domain / Website

The domain FRIENDSOFSCIENCE.ORG was registered May 9, 2002, through Tucows Inc. to Charles Simpson, 1121 Valois Avenue SW, Calgary, Alberta T2T1L4, Canada, a "retired oil industry employee". [41] Simpson is also the administrative contact. The technical contact is Mirek Chynal of Commerx Corporation, #200, 555 - 11th Ave SW, Calgary, Alberta T2R1P6, Canada.
The DMOZ listing reads: "Offers critical scientific evidence, including a five-piece video, that challenges the premises of the Kyoto Protocol, and presents alternative causes of climate change."
[edit]
Contact details

P.O. Box 23167, Connaught Post Office
Calgary, AB T2S 3B1
Phone: 403 236-4203
FAX: 403 236-4203
Website: http://www.friendsofscience.org/

[edit]
Related SourceWatch resources
[edit]
External Links

[edit]
Profiles
[edit]
FoS website past versions

http://web.archive.org/web/*/http://...sofscience.org
[edit]
2002
[edit]
2005
[edit]
2006
[edit]
2007



Quote:
Criticism

Friends of Science states:[2]
Accurate satellite, balloon and mountain top observations made over the last three decades have not shown any significant change in the long term rate of increase in global temperatures. Average ground station readings do show a mild warming of 0.6 to 0.8 C over the last 100 years, which is well within the natural variations recorded in the last millennium. The ground station network suffers from an uneven distribution across the globe; the stations are preferentially located in growing urban and industrial areas ("heat islands"), which show substantially higher readings than adjacent rural areas ("land use effects"). The statement is contrary to the evidence reported in the scientific literature in several respects. The satellite temperature record and ground level observations both show significant warming,[3] though the statement that the observed warming over the last century has been 0.6 to 0.8°C is generally accepted. Contrary to the claim regarding the last millennium, most studies have concluded that the last 25 years are likely to have been the warmest in the past millennium (see hockey stick controversy). Analyses of surface data show that urban and rural sites have warmed at almost the same rate (within 0.05 degrees), indicating the effect of urban heat islands on measured temperature trends is small.[4]

Global mean surface temperatures 1856 to 2005


Friends of Science has been criticised as an Astroturfing organization[5] with close links to the oil industry.[6]
Friends of Science has produced a 23 minute on-line video[7] that claims to contrast the views of politicians and scientists on the question of climate change. The scientists on the video included consultant Tim Ball, Prof. Tim Patterson of Carleton University, and Prof. Barry Cooper of the University of Calgary, all of whom are known for skepticism with regard to the mainstream scientific view on global warming. Scientists representing the mainstream view were not strongly represented.

[edit] References
  1. ^ Friends of Science. Retrieved on 2007-03-05.
  2. ^ Myths/Facts: Common Misconceptions About Global Warming. Retrieved on 2007-03-05.
  3. ^ Temperature Trends in the Lower Atmosphere: Steps for Understanding and Reconciling Differences. CCSP Synthesis and Assessment Product 1.1. Retrieved on 2007-03-05.
  4. ^ Thomas C. Peterson (2003). "Assessment of Urban Versus Rural In Situ Surface Temperatures in the Contiguous United States: No Difference Found". Journal of Climate 16: 2941–2959.
  5. ^ Who's still cool on global warming?. Retrieved on 2007-03-05.
  6. ^ The Denial Machine - a CBC documentary about climate scepticism and funding. Retrieved on 2007-03-05.
  7. ^ Climate Catastrophe Cancelled: What You're Not Being Told About the Science of Climate Change. Retrieved on 2007-03-05.

[edit] See also


Why must I keep educating your STUPID STUPID ass?


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friends_of_Science

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php...nds_of_Science

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  #3  
Old 03-14-2007, 05:49 AM
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Heres a documentary about the scams this group and others have pulled, they have been exposed over and over but mentally gimped people get sucked into it ...

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...84499045867811


Quote:
Who is keeping the debate of global warming alive?


The documentary shows how fossil fuel corporations have kept the global warming debate alive long after most scientists believed that global warming was real and had potentially catastrophic consequences. It shows that companies such as Exxon Mobil are working with top public relations firms and using many of the same tactics and personnel as those employed by Phillip Morris and RJ Reynolds to dispute the cigarette-cancer link in the 1990s. Exxon Mobil sought out those willing to question the science behind climate change, providing funding for some of them, their organizations and their studies.

The Denial Machine also explores how the arguments supported by oil companies were adopted by policy makers in both Canada and the U.S. and helped form government policy.
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Old 03-14-2007, 05:51 AM
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More education for you ...

Quote:
Get Informed!

There is a war going on... a war for the hearts and minds of people, being waged by large corporations against society in the name of higher profits. We will not name any names on this site, but with a little research it all will become blatantly obvious. Please watch all the videos listed above and spread the word.
If you think ...
  • scientists are debating whether global warming is real
  • humans are not drastically contributing to global warming
  • current global warming is just a natural cycle
  • global warming is a good thing
... then you NEED to get informed! You have been duped, brainwashed, swindled, call it what you will, but you MUST find the truth. You are being lied to and made to doubt things that no real scientists are argueing about. You owe it to yourself to learn the truth.
This is too important to be ignored! Your future and that of your children depends on it! Are we being alarmist? YES! In this current fog of uncertainty and doubt that has been propagated by corporate interests, unfortunately alarmism is the only thing that gets noticed and gets people talking.
But... global warming deniers say the sun is causing our current warming!
This is an odd claim to make because solar radiation has been declining during the last 10+ years, as recorded by our satellites orbiting the earth.
Read what scientists have to say about this.
But... global warming deniers say that even Mars is warming!
The same people that want to dismiss 150 years of direct temperature readings, 800,000 years of ice core data will instantly jump to conclusions based on a few years of photos of Mars' South Pole. Something sound wrong here?
Read what scientists have to say about this.
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  #5  
Old 03-14-2007, 07:04 AM
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Oh by teh way Monkey, just by how you posted this:

Quote:
Oh shit *LOL*

Only you would be suckered into this ...
No wonder no one wants to listen to you Monkey, tsk tsk.

By teh way this organization is NOT still under a legal action, it ended lik ea year ago, wake up.

And love how you attack his integerty, and find it ok to do that, but yet if someone does the same to you its like attacking you and wrong, how typical Monkey. Learn how to type your posts in a nice way, maybe we will want to discuss it with you. I will go over your other so called "info". Althought i wi=ont be suprised it isnt also farse.
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Old 03-14-2007, 07:10 AM
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Just like i can say you have been brainwashed and duped.

Other reasons why those of us shouldnt listen to you. You make attacks like this, and so do those that think like you.

Quote:
Why must I keep educating your STUPID STUPID ass?
Monkey until you learn to debate respectively, no one will pay attantion to you here.

Now show info with out the attacks, or i will have to talk to the mods on removing hte material you stated here. I didnt attack any, so you shouldn't.
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Old 03-14-2007, 07:12 AM
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By teh way Monkey, if you cant see the politicing of some of what you say are suporters of Global warming, you are just as what you call me again?

"STUPID STUPID ass"
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  #8  
Old 03-14-2007, 07:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragon
Oh by teh way Monkey, just by how you posted this:



No wonder no one wants to listen to you Monkey, tsk tsk.

By teh way this organization is NOT still under a legal action, it ended lik ea year ago, wake up.

And love how you attack his integerty, and find it ok to do that, but yet if someone does the same to you its like attacking you and wrong, how typical Monkey. Learn how to type your posts in a nice way, maybe we will want to discuss it with you. I will go over your other so called "info". Althought i wi=ont be suprised it isnt also farse.


Oh Dragon, I dont hold any hope for you so just read ...
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Old 03-14-2007, 07:28 AM
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Actually some consider the Warming a scam, just as much as they considered the global coolin gof 30 years ago a scam.

http://www.denverpost.com/search/ci_4387552

http://www.aim.org/aim_report/5287_0_4_0_C/

Interesting stories on those that say one thing, but cant show so called proof.

http://www.nodnc.com/modules.php?nam...owpage&pid=106

And now look at the garbage they post as headlines ehre:

http://www.newstarget.com/global_warming.html

Cows causing global warming? And more. Monkey you dont know how much you sound like an ass attacking me with those words....

Like i ahve read somewhere...enviromentalist is the new cult.
Moneky it is one thing to want to keep our planet clean, but its anotehr to cause scare tactics like what many of the groups you follow.
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Old 03-14-2007, 07:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArghMonkey
Oh Dragon, I dont hold any hope for you so just read ...

See what i mean all? He keeps right on going looking like this...can you actually post a post without the attacks? Didnt think so. Why dont you actually read hmm? Open your little mind. The rest of us sane people did.
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  #11  
Old 03-14-2007, 08:15 AM
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ArghMonkey ArghMonkey is offline
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Yes its a cult Dragon ...
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Dragon busted on his lies ... HERE!

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"I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man's reasoning powers are not above the monkey's” - Mark Twain

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  #12  
Old 03-14-2007, 04:12 PM
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See, this is how he acts when someone stands up to him. Typical.
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  #13  
Old 03-14-2007, 04:21 PM
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An article that discusses that some scientists disagree.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/liv...n_page_id=1965

Once again its about politics. Sadly that is how the gree bees will treat this and always will, just like how Gore refuses to debete in a forum with other scientists...

Has anyone watched this program?


http://www.channel4.com/science/micr...dle/index.html
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  #14  
Old 03-14-2007, 08:36 PM
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ArghMonkey ArghMonkey is offline
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Heres a documentary about the scams this group and others have pulled, they
have been exposed over and over but mentally gimped people get sucked into it ...

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...84499045867811

Quote:
Who is keeping the debate of global warming alive?


The documentary shows how fossil fuel corporations have kept the global warming debate alive long after most scientists believed that global warming was real and had potentially catastrophic consequences. It shows that companies such as Exxon Mobil are working with top public relations firms and using many of the same tactics and personnel as those employed by Phillip Morris and RJ Reynolds to dispute the cigarette-cancer link in the 1990s. Exxon Mobil sought out those willing to question the science behind climate change, providing funding for some of them, their organizations and their studies.

The Denial Machine also explores how the arguments supported by oil companies were adopted by policy makers in both Canada and the U.S. and helped form government policy.
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Dragon busted on his lies ... HERE!

**
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**************
*******
**

"I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man's reasoning powers are not above the monkey's” - Mark Twain

*************************
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  #15  
Old 03-14-2007, 09:44 PM
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Once again you use such terms Monkey:

Quote:
mentally gimped people

Stop it.

Then again i can find articles that state your articales are sham too.

Lets stick with the facts.

Now this is facts by a scientist. Not some dumb news article.

http://www.warwickhughes.com/icecore/

he is stating that pre-industrial numbers were a lot higher then what many in the so called man-made global warming camp have been saying.

An interesting thing i have been reading is how when these groups collect core samples from both Greenland and Antartica, they are finding that the levels are different, indicating that we might not be causing the situation like we think we are...meaning the readings we are taking might show differnetly. Also the fact that in the last 800,000 years, there was periods were there was more carbon in the atmosphere then there is now. Also what many of these scientists dont want you to know is that much of the carbon does go else where too, oceans, land and what not, if not including planet life. Now i will admit there is evidence that shows that plants have an effect on how levels of carbon can go up slightly, so if these so called groups id less to attack companies and individuals and actually point out the facts, they might get places more so intheir arguements.
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